SOA questions

[lindstromjd]

I'm using a front/rear set of Chevy axles for a spring-over conversion on my 1975 Scout 2.

Question #1: They came without the center link that connects the two front hubs for steering, and I don't know where to look (or what it's actually called to look up) to get a new one. Anybody?

Question #2: Anybody ever done a swap and kept the Chevy axles the standard width instead of shortening them to fit under the Scout? Either way, any tips would be great, otherwise I'm gonna end up doing this trial-and-error style and figure out what works for myself.

Question #3: Haven't decided if I'm going to do a reverse shackle in the front or not. Any input here is appreciated.

Basically, if anyone has done anything even close to what I'm going to do, please let me know and tell me what all you did to make it work.

[WarlordX]

I saw one that had it done, the tires definitely stick out a bunch ha ha, but you could counter that with more backspacing i would think..

[lindstromjd]

I guess when you're one of the guys that answers questions more than asks them, there's not a whole lot of help to be found, huh?

[john breeze]

question 1. i would try lmc trucks parts they a very good and you can get a catalog for free lots of pictures.

question 2. back spacing or chop it,or fender flares

question 3. you are on your own with this one

sorry i couldn't be more help

[WarlordX]

HE he yeah ive only actually seen it done a couple times. One friend of mine has a scout 80 he runs 39.5 on 1 ton axles out of something.. i forget what make truck.

And there was one S2 for sale in my home town b4 i moved and it looked silly. I think he didn't backspace them at all so they stuck out AT LEAST 10-12 " past the body

I LOLd a little at his vehicle, and the 6500$ price tag on its window

[lindstromjd]

Well, thanks for the input guys. At least I have a better starting point now.

[ihscout800]

Lindstromjd,

Thanks for the post, I just signed on and have been reading a ton of threads. This is the closest I have seen yet to my questions.

I plan to do an SOA on a 1970 800A. I am worried about tire clearance on the springs during turning if I am running 33s or 35s. I have never done an SOA so all is new to me. Any guidance would be nice. My thought was to use full size ford 9 inch front and rear, 4.56 gears, 4 wheel disk brakes, and back spaced wheels.

Does anyone know the Plus/minus of running wider axles for moderate wheeling? Will it help stability on a lifted rig on the hwy?

[WarlordX]

Well if your gonna run 33/35's the stock 27/30 axles will not be sufficient. Im alittle hesitant to run 35's on my d44's and i have full chromoly shafts and truss bars front and rear ( i may just have a lead foot tho haha)


One major advantage to the full width axles will be u will much less likely have a problem with rubbing on turns since the tires will be a few inches farther out from the frame and tub/body

Personally i like the d44 scout width, so i just limited my steering and got about 1 inch less backspacing then i would have. Makes my 12.5s stick out maybe 1 inch or an inch and a half?


Your hardest part, is going to be gettin all the angles correct. you will also need a substaintial experience in welding (if u plan on doing it all urself)



Also LInd, did u figure out this question?

"Question #1: They came without the center link that connects the two front hubs for steering, and I don't know where to look (or what it's actually called to look up) to get a new one. Anybody?"


Are you talking about the "Tie rod" that connects the 2 outer knuckles ? close to where the drag link comes in as well (on scout knuckles that is)
And if you know the axle.. im sure u can find a DOM tubing one on some axle/4x4ing site

[lindstromjd]

Also LInd, did u figure out this question?

"Question #1: They came without the center link that connects the two front hubs for steering, and I don't know where to look (or what it's actually called to look up) to get a new one. Anybody?"


Are you talking about the "Tie rod" that connects the 2 outer knuckles ? close to where the drag link comes in as well (on scout knuckles that is)
And if you know the axle.. im sure u can find a DOM tubing one on some axle/4x4ing site

Actually, I think we're on the same page on that one. I was looking around (albeit not too hard, I admit) and couldn't find anything on it right away. Thought maybe I was looking up the wrong part.

[WarlordX]

So wait what axle are you using up front? i might be able to find you one real quick online.. im a master of the search lol you said it was a set of chevys right?

is the front a.. 10 or 12 bolt?

[Rascus]

Well if your gonna run 33/35's the stock 27/30 axles will not be sufficient. Im alittle hesitant to run 35's on my d44's and i have full chromoly shafts and truss bars front and rear ( i may just have a lead foot tho haha)

35's on D44's is not strong enough? if so that sucks i guess my 30 won't work then for what I wanted to do.

[lindstromjd]

So wait what axle are you using up front? i might be able to find you one real quick online.. im a master of the search lol you said it was a set of chevys right?

is the front a.. 10 or 12 bolt?

Chevy 10 bolt... stock 1/2 ton axles with 6 lugs and 3:73 limited slip..

[WarlordX]

I duno some will do it, ima run 35's but i wouldnt do anything larger. (i am running C-moly front and back, with extra thick bearing retainers inthe back etc etc. but my 2 cents... Don't use a d30 for 35's ha ha I have a d30 on my jeep.. that thing is a POS even with 33's. D35 was too small for the 33s as well. Look what happened to us in death valley.... Now we are doing a total rebuild on it as well.

New ford 8.8 with disc, CV d shaft, double chain rebuilt xfer case witha slip yoke elim and a rebuilt ax15 trans so almost a whole new drive train ha-ha

"better safe than sorry" is my motto now...

and heres Me looking like a ruffian after some F18s buzzed us from china lake, they probably laughed at our asses down there

Earlier, This one.. was following us and doing the wing waves and other various tricks for about 25 minutes while we were off roading it was pretty surreal watching him do it basically just for us

[WarlordX]

And Lind, i looked for a tie rod.. couldnt find the exact one, Do you know what vehicle its out of..? id say your best bet is junkyard it.. or have one made out of DOM, i mean it doesn't have to be really really close.. because (i think) u just adjust it with the tiered ends (thats how the scout one i had fabd is) because they can be adjusted in and out like an inch

Btw im curious, whyd u go to 10 bolts? Since they are bascially the same strength as d44's, seems like alota work for a moderate strength increase at best, Why not a 3/4 or 1 ton trucks axles? (thas what i wana do someday in the far off future)

[lindstromjd]

Yeah, I can't seem to find the right one online either. And I've checked about 4 different places now. I might just have to go to a junkyard (gasp... not on a Scout!!) to find some parts. No big deal.

But the reason I went with the 10 bolts is because I got two different sets for 300.00 bones and one of them is limited slip... kinda hard to pass that one up. I figured that if I set everything up using the 10's, I could at the very least upgrade sometime in the future.

[WarlordX]

Yeah i had the same outlook, since i got the scout 2 front44 from a parts car i got for like 300$ with a cage and some other parts i needed. Ifi break the 44's, ill upgrade to corp14 bolt and a d60 hehe gotta find those first tho

[ihscout800]

Thanks for the feed back. I was going with the 9inch because I already have the rear just need the front. But I have not found any posts with people using ford. Am I heading down the wrong road?? Is this just due to the 1/2 ton rating of the 9ich?

Lindstromjd, are you still going with the full size axles? I'd like to see some pics if you or anyone have any.

Warlord, do you have any pics of your rig? Did you add a lift with your SOA or just let the SOA be the lift? Has anyone used the CJ5 springs with the SOA? I read in a post around here somewhere that it was a good option.

[WarlordX]

mine has a 7 inch lift. 4 from the SOA 2 from shackle reverse and 1 from laser cut shackles. front isn't 100% complete.. i still need to finish the front end and get some CV drive shafts made.

Ill see if i can get a few pics of the back and what i have finished in the front

[Allan E.]

Front D44 from a blazer or suburban are substantially stronger than a Scout D44, and they are also spring over configured already.

You will not know what mods need to be made to the axle until you put it together and look. The caster and pinion angle issues still exist. Chevy springs are flatter than IH springs. I believe the years in question are through 88, but you'll have to measure and check no matter what.

(centerpin to centerpin is a pretty good way to measure)

Spring perch width on a 74/75 IH pickup is the same as on a scout. Another source for SOA. This is also true of many dodge axles, such as ramcharger/trailblazer (plymouth version) from the 70s and early 80s.

The axle tube width plus spring pack width gives you the amount of lift you will get. If you lift a vehicle that much, you change the center of gravity. It may be that you need to widen the stance, which is why the axles are not as narrow from the factory...

You can clear 33 inch tires with a straight springover or a 4 inch spring lift plus 2 inch body lift. If you go with 9.5" width, they will tuck, and the 4 inch lift is enough. Eventually the tire has to rub on the spring, so you have to widen the distance between wheel mounting surfaces.

A ford 9" rear end takes a whole lot more input torque than a D44. A 10 bolt chevy is almost as strong as a scout D44. The D44 used on blazers was much stronger than the one from a scout. Stronger tubes.

There will be steering box issues. They aren't hard to overcome. The steering design on the scout is lame anyway, so any excuse to upgrade it works.

[hitler]

i meet guy who used chevy axleson his SCOUT so to keep from the wheels sticking out he got hummer wheels worked well for the job . hope this helps

[lindstromjd]

Thanks for the feed back. I was going with the 9inch because I already have the rear just need the front. But I have not found any posts with people using ford. Am I heading down the wrong road?? Is this just due to the 1/2 ton rating of the 9ich?

Lindstromjd, are you still going with the full size axles? I'd like to see some pics if you or anyone have any.

Warlord, do you have any pics of your rig? Did you add a lift with your SOA or just let the SOA be the lift? Has anyone used the CJ5 springs with the SOA? I read in a post around here somewhere that it was a good option.

It actually has nothing to do with the strength of Ford axles... just that you can't use the front axles because the transfer case is on the wrong (driver) side. Easier to use GM axles because there's no serious mods required.

Yes, I'm still going with the full size axles. Don't feel like trying to find someone to cut them down on my budget (an AF E-4 doesn't exactly make a lot of money). I'll just find some wheels with a decent inset instead of offset to help with them sticking out too much. That, and fender flares. Besides, it should also help with roll stability of the rig with it sitting a little wider than stock.

Unfortunately, I have too many projects to just stick with one consistently. I haven't started in on my SOA lift yet, but it's next on the list. Maybe another 2 months or so and I'll be far enough along on my other projects to give them a little rest.

[Manerd]

I am doing a conversion like this right now on my 68' 800. Reverse shackle with Scout II leaf springs up front, axles off a 77' 3/4 ton GMC dana 44 front with flat top knuckles. I plan on putting high steer arms on so I can cut off the knuckle arm to fit my H1 double beadlocks, they will fit with wheel spacer but I dont want my wheels to stick out that far. 14 bolt FF rear, H1 beadlocks have a 7 inch backspacing so they look real good when finished tires only stick out about 1-1 1/2 inch. I have them on the back right now just waiting for a little $ so I can finish the high steer on the front.

[jayman2003]

If you have an experienced welder at your disposal (thank you dad), 2.5 inch superlift now, but everything else being stock (except for tires) what is a round about cost of doing the SOA? I mean a lift costs around 900 bucks...wondering the difference in cost from a lift which is all new equipment or an SOA which uses essentially stock equipment in a different way. Thanks guys...

[lindstromjd]

If you have an experienced welder at your disposal (thank you dad), 2.5 inch superlift now, but everything else being stock (except for tires) what is a round about cost of doing the SOA? I mean a lift costs around 900 bucks...wondering the difference in cost from a lift which is all new equipment or an SOA which uses essentially stock equipment in a different way. Thanks guys...

I'd say around 300.00 or so if you already know how to do everything. That includes the new leaf spring mounts, brake lines, and shocks.

[scoutguy66]

. Look what happened to us in death valley.... Now we are doing a total rebuild on it as well.



Thats what happened to my scout one time. Thought I had a flat tire till I looked back and seen the tire laying on the ground with the axle stickin up in the air. Turned out a siezed bearing was the culprit, fried and sucked through the retainer. other side was almost as bad.

[scoutguy66]

Question #1: They came without the center link that connects the two front hubs for steering, and I don't know where to look (or what it's actually called to look up) to get a new one. Anybody?

If you don't find a stock tie rod you could make one. just buy tie rod ends at the part store and find a piece of heavy dom tubing the right dia. to tap and screw the ends in.


Question #3: Haven't decided if I'm going to do a reverse shackle in the front or not. Any input here is appreciated.

I have heard it works great from everyone who has done it.